Lunar Threads

LuNaRtIc wrote:Wah! So Tempest isn't going to be Tempest?! ;0;
Whoo boy, that's going to be tough for me to take. xD I thought in the original Tempest was Temzin and Fresca was Pilya though? Am I missing something? D:

"Temzin" would have to be written テムジン, or Temujin, in Japanese. It could be that Game Arts had the English name first and then reversed it into Japanese, though it seems pretty unlikely that they would have stumbled upon Ghengis Khan's childhood name, Temujin, by accident.

LuNaRtIc wrote:Wah! So Tempest isn't going to be Tempest?! ;0;
Whoo boy, that's going to be tough for me to take.

I'll be very surprised if Tempest doesn't stay Tempest, if for no reason other than this sort of reaction.

They responded already

It was basically, sorry we can't please everyone.

It's a very strange choice to elect to please the smallest number of people instead of the largest.

Alunissage wrote:It's a very strange choice to elect to please the smallest number of people instead of the largest.

Indeed. Like mentioned before, the chances of a poorly loading remake of a 10-year-old remake with questionable Korean MMORPG character graphics selling significantly beyond the fandom are almost nonexistent. Like, when Falcom endlessly remakes Ys, they know that they should probably be pleasing the fans who...really like the old Ys. And this isn't even a hard job for XSeed, since they don't make anything at all, and had a fluent translation and generally well-liked actors available (at the very least, they're certainly no less qualified than the new American ones, so gripes with the old ones alone hardly justify the new cast).

I mean, I guess nobody really needs to be too bothered, since the PSP game will be a tiny blip on the radar compared with the 32-bit extravaganzas, but I can't say I understand the Americans' choice, either. Makes you wonder what went on behind closed doors, especially since they did bother to snatch Stigile and thus were clearly aiming on getting some part of the old cast (maybe without having to pay Victor Ireland?). On the plus side, Ireland seems to be pretty free about talking about inside stuff, or at least his perspective of it, so I'm sure he'll tell all one of these days.

I don't think it was a choice to please the smallest as much as it was a choice to blend the two groups together. What ended up happening is that they made a weird translation that bothers me. It has the structure of the old, while sounding like an episode of dragon ball z written by Shakespeare with a lobotomy.

The Die Hard Fans + the Newbies

I forgot to add this in but apparently Xseed reads this forum.

Alunissage wrote:It's a very strange choice to elect to please the smallest number of people instead of the largest.

Let's face it, the number of people who actually care about a few of these changes is incredibly small. I barely remember continent names from RPGs I played a few months ago let alone ones I played years ago unless I'm on websites dedicated to them and have people pointing them out constantly. They kept a lot of what the fanbase will remember (i.e. important character names like Alex and Quark, some of the humor, etc.) but elected to correct or improve a lot of what people would've forgotten about (i.e. continent and place names, the names of some skills, etc.). I'd imagine it's their attempt to both please the memory of the fanbase and create an adaptation that's a bit more faithful to the original. Sure, you can say that any switch back is unnecessary and thus "alienates" some incredibly small fraction of the Lunar gaming community, but I suppose it was a conscious decision on their part to set right a few of WD's frivolous changes wherever they felt it would have only a very minor impact. In short, even if they're pleasing the "smallest number of people", I doubt that figure is very much less than the "largest", and it could even be the same given that I'm sure there're enough people out there who disliked the WD localization to be happy rather than sad about some of XSEED's decisions.

I forgot to add this in but apparently Xseed reads this forum.

What makes you think so? For all you know they could be reading posts by gripers on GameFaqs.

Lunar Eclipse wrote:I'm sure there're enough people out there who disliked the WD localization to be happy rather than sad about some of XSEED's decisions.

That's the "smallest number" to which I was referring. I'd imagine the relative proportions to be something like this:

People familiar with the series enough to know the Japanese names AND who strongly object to WD's changes: x.

People familiar enough with the series to know the Japanese names and not care about or approve of WD's changes: 3x (that is, most people on this board).

People who are only familiar with previous English releases (including Ubi's localizations) and have fond enough memories of these earlier releases to object to what are to them totally out of left field alterations: 200x.

People who have never played the series before or don't remember enough to care: 10000x.

People who have never played the series before but went to the trouble to find out the original Japanese names (via research or import) and would therefore be annoyed at use of WD's alterations in XSeed's localization: epsilon.

x + epsilon < 203x

There may be far more people who won't know the difference or won't care, but those are irrelevant here. Why take the trouble to keep some of WD's lines and use WD's vocalist and at least some of WD's character names and then not use the location names too? Of the people who notice the difference from the WD (and Ubi!) games, very few are likely to be in favor of it.

Just to make clear that I am not automatically saying that everything WD did was best and should be the default (though I think most people here already know that), I should mention that I have no problem with Alex being identified as the son of Ohro. The reason is that in the Japanese games, Luna and Alex have always had Noa/Noah as their surname, as shown in the artbooks. Alex's father was therefore referred to by his last name (by the harbormaster in Saith as well as people in the village), which isn't that uncommon in some settings. I think it's mainly that Noah is already a first name in English that has let us all consider it to be Alex's father's first name. I'm okay with his name being Ohro Noah, or Noa. As with other things, I'd rather they used the Noah spelling for consistency with the WD games (I don't remember if the name was used at all in Legend since Alex's father was not in that game, only his mother), but giving him a first name doesn't bother me.

Silver Phoenix wrote:

I forgot to add this in but apparently Xseed reads this forum.

What makes you think so? For all you know they could be reading posts by gripers on GameFaqs.

I wrote them a letter and they wrote back. They mentioned that they read a lot of forums.

Commenting on the translation:

The new names don't bother me so much. Although Jessica having a different last name from her dad is slightly irritating. To me the problem is what I stated earlier. An over the top flowery translation full of idioms.

But it seems to me this is going to be the fanboy version.

i think people need to embrace the fact that working designs is already nonexistent, gaijinworks being not the localization choice of gamearts, probably because Vic is known in the gaming industry for delays...

i mean if people get the idea, then they would like the new lunar offering much better, for me, i think there was something lost in the transition of lunar during working designs era, which xseed is trying to bring to the audience... people need to understand that it's not only the old fans they're trying to please but for new fans to come to pick this up as well...

and i just don't get what's the problem with the names and translation...... caldor isle or honmel isle whatsoever... iluk or illuk, it's not as if they're very impt. with the story... let's face it.. this is so very minor injury... have you really expected that much to keep the remake into the same as it was before? i did not... that's why i'm not crying...

Where are people getting the translation change for Tempest? He's not in the characters page on the site, and if you check the text in the demo ISO, it pretty clearly uses Tempest.

Aaron wrote:I forgot to add this in but apparently Xseed reads this forum.

I would be curious to know how this was discovered.

Aaron wrote:But it seems to me this is going to be the fanboy version.

Uh, fanboy version? If anything, it seems the reverse is true with people immediately dismissing this version because they're so attached to the originals.

Aaron wrote:The new names don't bother me so much. Although Jessica having a different last name from her dad is slightly irritating. To me the problem is what I stated earlier. An over the top flowery translation full of idioms.

Background data explains that Mel added the 'de' to his name when he became governor of Meribia.

You've made it pretty apparent that you think the "heed the call of the wind" bit was lame. (For the record, it's an Xseed original.) So, what else do you think is over-the-top flowery? I thought the text was pretty straightforward for the most part. Also, you might want to read the Wikipedia article on idioms. While idioms are often metaphors, not all metaphors are idioms. They're a localizer's friend, an important part of making speech seem conversational.

XSEED has now hired me to do the voice-over for every character, because I'm that good. Excuse me while I chop off my balls and work up a lot of mucous so I sound extra nasally. I will also read in a very monotone voice because that is what you consider perfect expression when lines are read. I will do everything the original VA's did, because that is the only way you'll be happy.

/end bi+chcasm


Seriously though, I am quite good with voices and writing. This doesn't mean you have the end result by just playing a demo when in reality you have 1/100th of the end result. Not all of the voice work was perfect with the original cast, and it won't be here. Hopefully XSEED get's the trailer and the outtakes (HOLY SHI+) up soon so people can have a wider range of consideration. There will still be complaints, but you all really need to be thankful that XSEED is giving this game the attention it deserves by trying to please old and new fans alike. Most companies wouldn't even give us a freaking collector's edition, it would be game only. I think you should give them some credit, and we may be surprised in a good way.

Wouldn't be surprised at all to learn XSEED reads this board. It's the biggest Lunar presence on the net for english speakers, I'm sure they'd be interested to see what goes on here.

Site's also listed on SSH's main website (GungHo's) in the fan section.

Perhaps you mean they'd be horrified to find out what goes on here.

I am not surprised either. I am sure fan forums such as this one tells XSEED what fans like and what they dislike. I know its not possible to please everybody, but paying attention to what fans are saying is a big plus. Im surprised that the HSS (gungho's site) has a link to this site.

I also cannot wait for the trailer and the outtakes.

Alunissage wrote: People who have never played the series before but went to the trouble to find out the original Japanese names (via research or import) and would therefore be annoyed at use of WD's alterations in XSeed's localization: epsilon.

x + epsilon < 203x

This is the best post in the thread if for no other reason than the fact that you used epsilon to denote a small quantity.

Aaron wrote:The new names don't bother me so much. Although Jessica having a different last name from her dad is slightly irritating. To me the problem is what I stated earlier. An over the top flowery translation full of idioms.

Jessica's name is nothing new. She's had a different last name (Alkirk vs. de Alkirk) from her father in every single version of Lunar. KF